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BRANGLE FAMILY ROOM - 49
The message gets lost in the madness. It's weird seeing protesters in masks.
There are years that are just crazy - where it seems one thing after another goes wrong. That's 2020.
It's a disease, not a punch line
There are years that are just crazy - where it seems one thing after another goes wrong. That's 2020.
It's a disease, not a punch line
I understand where y'all are coming from when you say violence isn't the solution. However, I would like to note that I've watched some videos and a surprising number of people are white and are likely using this situation as an excuse to commit crimes. For example, the video of the first person smashing windows in Minneapolish at an Autozone shows a protestor trying to stop a white man from smashing windows. I also think the police are playing a role in instigating the violence. For example, I watched a video this morning of peaceful protesters and two police cars were driving at them, trying to run them over.
In addition, I don't think it's historically accurate to say that violence doesn't solve the issue. The suffragettes, Stonewall Riots, and the Boston Tea Party are all examples I can think of off the top of my head where destruction of property/violence was used successfully to create change (some people have also been citing the French Revolution in this category, but I don't personally remember enough about it to know if this is true, though, from my very hazy memory, I think it is). Even someone like Martin Luther King says that riots are the language of the unheard. And the thing is people have been trying to peacefully protest, but they have been unheard. For example, people chastised Colin Kaepernick for kneeling during the anthem as protest.
Do I love violence? No, but I can understand where they're coming from and I do think it has the potential to bring change.
Queen stays queen, adios!
In addition, I don't think it's historically accurate to say that violence doesn't solve the issue. The suffragettes, Stonewall Riots, and the Boston Tea Party are all examples I can think of off the top of my head where destruction of property/violence was used successfully to create change (some people have also been citing the French Revolution in this category, but I don't personally remember enough about it to know if this is true, though, from my very hazy memory, I think it is). Even someone like Martin Luther King says that riots are the language of the unheard. And the thing is people have been trying to peacefully protest, but they have been unheard. For example, people chastised Colin Kaepernick for kneeling during the anthem as protest.
Do I love violence? No, but I can understand where they're coming from and I do think it has the potential to bring change.
Queen stays queen, adios!
Violence does not change anything except create more hate.
What these people are doing is looting, being opportunists in the face of what should be a time to make positive change. Violent acts don't negate violent acts.
These people are not protesting.
They are looting, smashing, destroying people's lives - people are losing their livelihoods -they're being thugs and bullies!
What those police did is wrong. Not all police are like that.
Smearing all police with the same brush is exactly what you accuse the police of doing to you.
Anyway, I think ALL LIVES MATTER irrespective of colour.
Snappy Snappy Snap..Snap Snap Snap Snap!
What these people are doing is looting, being opportunists in the face of what should be a time to make positive change. Violent acts don't negate violent acts.
These people are not protesting.
They are looting, smashing, destroying people's lives - people are losing their livelihoods -they're being thugs and bullies!
What those police did is wrong. Not all police are like that.
Smearing all police with the same brush is exactly what you accuse the police of doing to you.
Anyway, I think ALL LIVES MATTER irrespective of colour.
Snappy Snappy Snap..Snap Snap Snap Snap!
I totally agree with you Snappy. These are very trying times and good must overcome evil. There are good and bad cops and good and bad citizens. We just pray the good reaches the bad and we can all live in harmony. I know it will take time, but it can be done.
You are right, all lives matter!
Formula for success: rise early, work hard, strike oil. J. Paul Getty
You are right, all lives matter!
Formula for success: rise early, work hard, strike oil. J. Paul Getty
Perhaps I came off a little angry or accusatory in my original post, but I want to clarify that I am in no way saying that people should be looting, especially since I see a lot of people who are destroying property aren't even doing it to protest but are, like you said snappy, opportunists who just want to wreak havoc (e.g. I've seen videos where someone is trying to start a riot and destroy property and the peaceful protesters are very quick to stop them and hand them over to the police). In addition, of course, looting and destroying property is going to have a negative effect on the community (Denver still recovering from the 1967 12th Street Riot comes to mind immediately), and I am worried for the future of the communities with mass looting. I also think it's really sad that people are focusing so much on the looting, because there are so many completely peaceful protests out there that should be getting the media's attention, and people who are looting are giving everyone who's peaceful a bad name. I know my city recently had one that had literally no violence in it.
I don't really know if this makes a lot of sense or if it's just a bunch of jumbled thoughts, but what I think what I'm trying to get at here is that talking only about the looting isn't productive, because they are a symptom of a larger systemic issue the US (and Canada seeing as I'm Canadian) has. They stem from a long-term race issue that we've had. In only talking about the looting, we are continuing to miss the fact that black people are disproportionately killed by the police, they make up a disproprtionate number of deaths from COVID-19, they are more likely to live in poverty, and so many other effects that come from systemic racism. Rather than condemning the looters, we should be talking about how we can bring justice to George Floyd, Breonna Taylor, etc's deaths and hold the police officers accountable for their actions or, more broadly, bring more accountability into the police system so that police officers who use unlawful force and kill innocent people are held responsible, or, even more broadly, dismantle systemic racism.
Also, I know you both mean well when you say all lives matter (and I agree that all lives do matter, regardless of race, gender, age, sexuality, religion, etc.), but I don't think it's the most productive thing to say right now since it distracts from the most pressing issue at hand right now. Hopefully this image works but this really helped me with understanding why it's more important to say "black lives matter" right now instead of "all lives matter".
I understand that it can seem like the issue with saying "all lives matter" is small potatoes and that it's being blown up into something that's larger than it should be, but language shapes how we think, which ultimately shapes, whether explicitly or implicitly, how we act.
Sorry, this reply is a little long, but, obviously, I'm passionate about activism, and this is something I've been thinking a lot about recently. I'm hoping this made sense and was thought-provoking, and, if you disagree, feel free to let me know. I know I can come off as a little extreme or set on my opinions, but I am genuinely open to reconsidering what I know and changing my mind.
Queen stays queen, adios!
I don't really know if this makes a lot of sense or if it's just a bunch of jumbled thoughts, but what I think what I'm trying to get at here is that talking only about the looting isn't productive, because they are a symptom of a larger systemic issue the US (and Canada seeing as I'm Canadian) has. They stem from a long-term race issue that we've had. In only talking about the looting, we are continuing to miss the fact that black people are disproportionately killed by the police, they make up a disproprtionate number of deaths from COVID-19, they are more likely to live in poverty, and so many other effects that come from systemic racism. Rather than condemning the looters, we should be talking about how we can bring justice to George Floyd, Breonna Taylor, etc's deaths and hold the police officers accountable for their actions or, more broadly, bring more accountability into the police system so that police officers who use unlawful force and kill innocent people are held responsible, or, even more broadly, dismantle systemic racism.
Also, I know you both mean well when you say all lives matter (and I agree that all lives do matter, regardless of race, gender, age, sexuality, religion, etc.), but I don't think it's the most productive thing to say right now since it distracts from the most pressing issue at hand right now. Hopefully this image works but this really helped me with understanding why it's more important to say "black lives matter" right now instead of "all lives matter".
I understand that it can seem like the issue with saying "all lives matter" is small potatoes and that it's being blown up into something that's larger than it should be, but language shapes how we think, which ultimately shapes, whether explicitly or implicitly, how we act.
Sorry, this reply is a little long, but, obviously, I'm passionate about activism, and this is something I've been thinking a lot about recently. I'm hoping this made sense and was thought-provoking, and, if you disagree, feel free to let me know. I know I can come off as a little extreme or set on my opinions, but I am genuinely open to reconsidering what I know and changing my mind.
Queen stays queen, adios!
Hermy, I think you have expressed yourself in a thoughtful and respectful way. 
As you mention, protest can be a powerful force for change, but is it the solution to injustice, corruption, and oppression?
You may be interested in reading the following articles, from the July 2013 issue of Awake! magazine.
Is Protest the Answer?
I Saw Injustice Everywhere
Most of the trouble in the world is caused by people wanting to be important. ~ T.S. Eliot
As you mention, protest can be a powerful force for change, but is it the solution to injustice, corruption, and oppression?
You may be interested in reading the following articles, from the July 2013 issue of Awake! magazine.
Is Protest the Answer?
I Saw Injustice Everywhere
Most of the trouble in the world is caused by people wanting to be important. ~ T.S. Eliot
I have a question
What are they protesting?
Fake The Disco!
What are they protesting?
Fake The Disco!
Rove_Tarts wrote:
Systemic racism.
Most of the trouble in the world is caused by people wanting to be important. ~ T.S. Eliot
What are they protesting?
Systemic racism.
Most of the trouble in the world is caused by people wanting to be important. ~ T.S. Eliot
I mean like, what are they trying to accomplish? 
Fake The Disco!
Fake The Disco!
Awareness. Getting people to talk about the issues that we usually avoid: racism, poverty, social justice, crime.
Some are advocating for changes in the methods police use in detaining suspects. This is a tough issue, because the police need to be able to subdue truly violent offenders.
It's a disease, not a punch line
Some are advocating for changes in the methods police use in detaining suspects. This is a tough issue, because the police need to be able to subdue truly violent offenders.
It's a disease, not a punch line
I think everyone's already aware
Fake The Disco!
Fake The Disco!
People may be aware, but they're not doing anything about it, so what good is that awareness? The protests are to inspire action to prevent more black people from being killed by the police, among myriad other unjust actions.
Writing is the only thing that, when I do it, I don't feel I should be doing something else. - Gloria Steinem
Writing is the only thing that, when I do it, I don't feel I should be doing something else. - Gloria Steinem
But pretty much everyone's already on their side
Fake The Disco!
Fake The Disco!
Rove_Tarts wrote:
Yeah, that's not true though. There is a segment of our society that is either ignorant of the issues or opposed to them for political or economic reasons.
And some people see protests as stirring up trouble... others just don't want their own way of life disrupted. And sadly, there are still pockets of hate and prejudice out there.
It's a disease, not a punch line
But pretty much everyone's already on their side
Yeah, that's not true though. There is a segment of our society that is either ignorant of the issues or opposed to them for political or economic reasons.
And some people see protests as stirring up trouble... others just don't want their own way of life disrupted. And sadly, there are still pockets of hate and prejudice out there.
It's a disease, not a punch line
Tilley wrote:
Haven't had a chance to read either one really in-depth yet and it's getting late (12:30 am whoops) but I'll make sure to look into them when I have time.
whoviandeb wrote:
Definitely agree with this. In fact, I'm not sure how much you know about CrossFit, but I heard that the owner (I believe, not exactly sure what his role is) said that he doesn't mourn George Floyd's death, so there definitely still are people who are unsympathetic in this situation. Furthermore, something important that I think's been coming out of this (at least from what I can see on my social media) is people becoming increasingly aware of their own prejudiced tendencies. I think a lot of people before this viewed racism as conscious acts of hatred, but people are becoming more aware that, even if they are not consciously racist, they are still implicitly perpetuating it.
Queen stays queen, adios!
Hermy, I think you have expressed yourself in a thoughtful and respectful way.
As you mention, protest can be a powerful force for change, but is it the solution to injustice, corruption, and oppression?
You may be interested in reading the following articles, from the July 2013 issue of Awake! magazine.
Is Protest the Answer?
I Saw Injustice Everywhere
As you mention, protest can be a powerful force for change, but is it the solution to injustice, corruption, and oppression?
You may be interested in reading the following articles, from the July 2013 issue of Awake! magazine.
Is Protest the Answer?
I Saw Injustice Everywhere
Haven't had a chance to read either one really in-depth yet and it's getting late (12:30 am whoops) but I'll make sure to look into them when I have time.
whoviandeb wrote:
Rove_Tarts wrote:
Yeah, that's not true though. There is a segment of our society that is either ignorant of the issues or opposed to them for political or economic reasons.
And some people see protests as stirring up trouble... others just don't want their own way of life disrupted. And sadly, there are still pockets of hate and prejudice out there.
But pretty much everyone's already on their side
Yeah, that's not true though. There is a segment of our society that is either ignorant of the issues or opposed to them for political or economic reasons.
And some people see protests as stirring up trouble... others just don't want their own way of life disrupted. And sadly, there are still pockets of hate and prejudice out there.
Definitely agree with this. In fact, I'm not sure how much you know about CrossFit, but I heard that the owner (I believe, not exactly sure what his role is) said that he doesn't mourn George Floyd's death, so there definitely still are people who are unsympathetic in this situation. Furthermore, something important that I think's been coming out of this (at least from what I can see on my social media) is people becoming increasingly aware of their own prejudiced tendencies. I think a lot of people before this viewed racism as conscious acts of hatred, but people are becoming more aware that, even if they are not consciously racist, they are still implicitly perpetuating it.
Queen stays queen, adios!
The cartoon about the house is very simplistic. Too much of a generalization.
Substitute 'HOUSE' for 'MY OPINION' and see what you think there. There are two sides to every story.
And hermygranger123 you say 'police kill innocent people' Really??? They KILL???
Again, I think there are two sides to every story. What happened to George F. should not have happened to him or anybody else. However, there are times when push comes to shove and someone dies due to a conflict of some sort.
If you are robbed, you call the police. If you are raped, you call the police. If you are in a car accident, you call the police. Hmm.
My belief is that if you are told to do something by a policeman [Put your hands up or stop running away or whatever] you should do it. Stop. Yes, you'll be arrested and taken in. But you will get your time to explain yourself. Police don't just bash you up because you are standing still. OFCOURSE there are times when reason goes out the window and bad things happen. We can't excuse those.
In a democracy we need to look at both sides before we judge. That is why we say there is PRE JUDICE...you prejudge.
I agree that people don't know what they are protesting about Rove-Tarts. Most people are brainless followers. They are re-writing history by destroying statues and banning movies like Gone with the Wind - they are trying to wipe the slate clean. I think it is important to look back at injustices of the history, have them firmly in your head and then not repeat them.
We are turning George Orwell's prediction into reality.
If you haven't already done so, go read "1984".
Snappy Snappy Snap..Snap Snap Snap Snap!
Substitute 'HOUSE' for 'MY OPINION' and see what you think there. There are two sides to every story.
And hermygranger123 you say 'police kill innocent people' Really??? They KILL???
Again, I think there are two sides to every story. What happened to George F. should not have happened to him or anybody else. However, there are times when push comes to shove and someone dies due to a conflict of some sort.
If you are robbed, you call the police. If you are raped, you call the police. If you are in a car accident, you call the police. Hmm.
My belief is that if you are told to do something by a policeman [Put your hands up or stop running away or whatever] you should do it. Stop. Yes, you'll be arrested and taken in. But you will get your time to explain yourself. Police don't just bash you up because you are standing still. OFCOURSE there are times when reason goes out the window and bad things happen. We can't excuse those.
In a democracy we need to look at both sides before we judge. That is why we say there is PRE JUDICE...you prejudge.
I agree that people don't know what they are protesting about Rove-Tarts. Most people are brainless followers. They are re-writing history by destroying statues and banning movies like Gone with the Wind - they are trying to wipe the slate clean. I think it is important to look back at injustices of the history, have them firmly in your head and then not repeat them.
We are turning George Orwell's prediction into reality.
If you haven't already done so, go read "1984".
Snappy Snappy Snap..Snap Snap Snap Snap!
I'm not sure what to think about the statues being destroyed, but some things belong in a historical museum rather than on display in a town square. A statue in public celebrates that person's accomplishments. A statue in a museum can be put into a context that educates people on what it stood for.
It's like a Nazi flag... shown in its historical context we learn what it represented, flown in public it only gives offense.
It's a disease, not a punch line
It's like a Nazi flag... shown in its historical context we learn what it represented, flown in public it only gives offense.
It's a disease, not a punch line
"Defund the police"
*Weapon sales have gone up 80%*
Funny ironic
Fake The Disco!
*Weapon sales have gone up 80%*
Funny ironic
Fake The Disco!
Rove those are both good things I would argue
"I need to be myself. I can't be no one else." - Noel Gallagher
"I need to be myself. I can't be no one else." - Noel Gallagher
Defunding the police or funny ironic?
---This message was edited on 04:21PM Jun 11, 2020---
Fake The Disco!
---This message was edited on 04:21PM Jun 11, 2020---
Fake The Disco!
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