The Werewolf Game
Game #3244: Seer Special (maybe)
This game is moderated by talanpoe. Please read the rules and contact the moderator with any questions or concerns about this game.
This game finished in 7 rounds.
I'd like to try something new (or at least I haven't seen it before).
This game will have a Wolf talkbox. Normally this gives the wolves a big advantage; I'd like to offset that by extending the Seer role.
The Seer will (secretly, by PM to me, at a time of the Seer's own choosing) designate a successor. That successor will designated a successor in similar fashion at the appropriate time. If all three meet their demise, the Seer role will terminate.
Should the Seer meet his/her fate, I will notify the replacement and they will assume the Seer role (through me). The replacement seer will then designate their successor. The process will repeat if the replacement meets their demise.
Important notes:
1) The Seer can take as long as they wish to designate a replacement; but if a seer/replacement dies before designating a successor, there will be no successor and the Seer role terminates.
2) If a seer and their successor both die during the same shooting/eating cycle, the Seer role terminates.
3) If the seer dies without revealing any information, that information dies with them. (The successor is independent and receives no info from their predecessor.)
4) The designation of a successor is irrevocable. However, if the successor predeceases the original Seer, then a new successor may be named. There will only be two designated successors in the life of the game.
5) If (heaven forfend) a wolf is named as a successor, then the humans have a problem. The only way to undo the damage would be through #4 above.
Two additional provisions following discussion:
1) I will not announce seer demises until/unless the seer function is ended (with a history of the holders thereof); and
2) There will be no succession after the beginning of R4. Whoever (if any) is seer at dawn on the 4th is the last seer.
And, of course, an explicit instruction not to discuss login times.
So let's see if that balances the wolf TB. Let the experiment begin....
IF I NEED TO ADD ANYBODY AS A FRIEND, please msg me. Thanks!
---This message was edited on 2017-04-28 20:27:00---
This game will have a Wolf talkbox. Normally this gives the wolves a big advantage; I'd like to offset that by extending the Seer role.
The Seer will (secretly, by PM to me, at a time of the Seer's own choosing) designate a successor. That successor will designated a successor in similar fashion at the appropriate time. If all three meet their demise, the Seer role will terminate.
Should the Seer meet his/her fate, I will notify the replacement and they will assume the Seer role (through me). The replacement seer will then designate their successor. The process will repeat if the replacement meets their demise.
Important notes:
1) The Seer can take as long as they wish to designate a replacement; but if a seer/replacement dies before designating a successor, there will be no successor and the Seer role terminates.
2) If a seer and their successor both die during the same shooting/eating cycle, the Seer role terminates.
3) If the seer dies without revealing any information, that information dies with them. (The successor is independent and receives no info from their predecessor.)
4) The designation of a successor is irrevocable. However, if the successor predeceases the original Seer, then a new successor may be named. There will only be two designated successors in the life of the game.
5) If (heaven forfend) a wolf is named as a successor, then the humans have a problem. The only way to undo the damage would be through #4 above.
Two additional provisions following discussion:
1) I will not announce seer demises until/unless the seer function is ended (with a history of the holders thereof); and
2) There will be no succession after the beginning of R4. Whoever (if any) is seer at dawn on the 4th is the last seer.
And, of course, an explicit instruction not to discuss login times.
So let's see if that balances the wolf TB. Let the experiment begin....
IF I NEED TO ADD ANYBODY AS A FRIEND, please msg me. Thanks!
---This message was edited on 2017-04-28 20:27:00---
sounds cool
Index for WW/WTB databases - https://ksteven.github.io/playground/ (Data refreshed: 2021-12-07)
Index for WW/WTB databases - https://ksteven.github.io/playground/ (Data refreshed: 2021-12-07)
sounds hip
fwiw i dont think the wolf TB is THAT big an advantage...its best use is to get 'approval' for wolves to bus another (less hard feelings) so you have to stretch your radius a bit on entertaining potential busses
Can you imagine what I would do if I could do all I can - Sun Tzu
fwiw i dont think the wolf TB is THAT big an advantage...its best use is to get 'approval' for wolves to bus another (less hard feelings) so you have to stretch your radius a bit on entertaining potential busses
Can you imagine what I would do if I could do all I can - Sun Tzu
Sounds like a very interesting concept
Opinions please.
I planned to announce identities (including those involved in the seer role), but it occurred to me that if players learn that "X" was the seer, they might be able to guess (with some accuracy) that "X" would have picked "Y" as their successor. (Alternatively, if they learn that "Y" was successor, they might backtrack to "X" as the seer.)
Question 1: do you think this is a valid concern?
Question 2 (assuming you do): which would be your preferred option:
Thanks.
---This message was edited on 2017-04-28 20:21:24---
I planned to announce identities (including those involved in the seer role), but it occurred to me that if players learn that "X" was the seer, they might be able to guess (with some accuracy) that "X" would have picked "Y" as their successor. (Alternatively, if they learn that "Y" was successor, they might backtrack to "X" as the seer.)
Question 1: do you think this is a valid concern?
Question 2 (assuming you do): which would be your preferred option:
Option 1: Announce all roles including seer/successors as they happen
orOption 2: Announce seers only when the seer role is extinguished with a history of the holders thereof
orOption 3:....? Something else?
The choice, of course is mine (oh the power!) but I do want to know what you think.Thanks.
---This message was edited on 2017-04-28 20:21:24---
I think announcing the successors ID adds an interesting dynamic...it seems the seer will be anointing his divination as his successor (to ensure it does not go to a wolf)....im not sure if i missed it in your rules, but I dont think the successor should inherit the seer's divinations. Mods greatly underestimate how powerful IDs really are in the mid/endgame. Just one extra 'free human' (similar to froggy 'free divining' herself last game) is very very powerful swing.
If anything you could consider having a 'fallback seer' with this mechanic. The seer chooses his successor at the start of the game, or early on..or to avoid the wolf problem you choose it..or however it needs to be done. That successor PMs you with a div choice each night (you may tell the successor who the real seer is or not). The successor DOES NOT get this info unless the real seer dies within the first 3 rounds (Seers are too powerful in Round 4 and beyond to need to be balanced against the wolf TB imo)
So basically this acts more like early seer death insurance, just my opinion take it with a grain of salt, but rules that try to empower the seer are very very double edged and easy to make the game a cakewalk
---This message was edited on 2017-04-28 09:04:44---
Can you imagine what I would do if I could do all I can - Sun Tzu
If anything you could consider having a 'fallback seer' with this mechanic. The seer chooses his successor at the start of the game, or early on..or to avoid the wolf problem you choose it..or however it needs to be done. That successor PMs you with a div choice each night (you may tell the successor who the real seer is or not). The successor DOES NOT get this info unless the real seer dies within the first 3 rounds (Seers are too powerful in Round 4 and beyond to need to be balanced against the wolf TB imo)
So basically this acts more like early seer death insurance, just my opinion take it with a grain of salt, but rules that try to empower the seer are very very double edged and easy to make the game a cakewalk
---This message was edited on 2017-04-28 09:04:44---
Can you imagine what I would do if I could do all I can - Sun Tzu
Wahooey - a talanpoe game! Looks like a fun game concept.
"I discovered I scream the same whether I'm about to be devoured by a Great White or if a piece of seaweed touches my foot." Axl Rose
"I discovered I scream the same whether I'm about to be devoured by a Great White or if a piece of seaweed touches my foot." Axl Rose
I like Spider's idea, nice job Spid.
Also, I think that maybe you could announce whether that round has the original seer, the successor, or no seer, but no names attached.
Also, I think that maybe you could announce whether that round has the original seer, the successor, or no seer, but no names attached.
it has been a year since I played these games and I am happy to come here again. So In regards to the experiment suggested by talanpoe, The seer will tell the mod who their successor will be and the role of the seer is passed on, right?
In that case, I guess spider's idea would be most suitable.
I might be a little rusty considering it's been a long time but I look forward to playing with all of you
---This message was edited on 2017-04-28 11:29:36---
In that case, I guess spider's idea would be most suitable.
I might be a little rusty considering it's been a long time but I look forward to playing with all of you
---This message was edited on 2017-04-28 11:29:36---
Spider – yes, I intended that anything learned by the seer but not disclosed would be lost; the successor would be starting from scratch. (Note #3 above, though I concede it didn't explicitly exclude the successor. Until now.)
Comprehension check on the Option 3 being proposed:
This would, also, though, have the potential to result in two sets of seer data. If Seer manages to convey their findings somehow, demises before R4, and the information isn't found until after the Backup has been activated.
---This message was edited on 2017-04-28 20:18:39---
Comprehension check on the Option 3 being proposed:
Option 3: Rather than Seer + Successor + Successor, there would be a Seer + Backup (+ 2ndBackup?). The seer would designate the backup as above (i.e., whenever they wanted to, irrevocably, etc.) The Backup would send in their divination requests via PM but would receive no information unless Seer dies before Round 4.
This would make it likely that a seer person would make it to R4. I would suggest also that if Seer dies horrifically in R1 (as has been known to happen, especially if the mantle falls on an inactive), then I would select a replacement at random from among the humans.This would, also, though, have the potential to result in two sets of seer data. If Seer manages to convey their findings somehow, demises before R4, and the information isn't found until after the Backup has been activated.
---This message was edited on 2017-04-28 20:18:39---
Yes....that is a hiccup.....it would deflate the interest of being the "successor" but in the 'Backup Seer' case you can simply translate the seer's divinations (he should be keeping you informed) to the successor in the event the seer dies. This way there is no potential crossover data......im not adverse to any of your suggestions I am just urging caution with the seer. You hit a mathematical limit much more easily then you think, a limit where the seer has enough data to win the game outright.
Can you imagine what I would do if I could do all I can - Sun Tzu
Can you imagine what I would do if I could do all I can - Sun Tzu
Then I think I'll stay with my original concept with the following additions:
1) I will not announce seer demises until/unless the seer function is ended (Option 2 above); and
2) There will be no succession after the beginning of R4. Whoever (if any) is seer at dawn on the 4th is the last seer.
---This message was edited on 2017-04-28 20:19:20---
1) I will not announce seer demises until/unless the seer function is ended (Option 2 above); and
2) There will be no succession after the beginning of R4. Whoever (if any) is seer at dawn on the 4th is the last seer.
---This message was edited on 2017-04-28 20:19:20---
we needn't have the "no seer after R4" thing, right?
when the seer is killed, the mod can just go this person was a seer and now it's been passed on/there are no successors.
when the seer is killed, the mod can just go this person was a seer and now it's been passed on/there are no successors.
What's the rule about white text?
There is no rule about white text. If you can get away with it, feel free.
Aishadit: I've decided to have no succession after R4, but certainly there will be whatever seer is in place at the time. (If somebody is so inclined, they're welcome to try variations on this setup.)
---This message was edited on 2017-04-28 20:19:52---
Aishadit: I've decided to have no succession after R4, but certainly there will be whatever seer is in place at the time. (If somebody is so inclined, they're welcome to try variations on this setup.)
---This message was edited on 2017-04-28 20:19:52---
I'd say give the wolves a TB for some balance
Dovie'andi se tovya sagain
Dovie'andi se tovya sagain
Jayo wrote:
"I discovered I scream the same whether I'm about to be devoured by a Great White or if a piece of seaweed touches my foot." Axl Rose
I'd say give the wolves a TB for some balance
LOL. Check the beginning of the 1st post: Seer succession is proposed to offset the advantage of a wolf TB.
"I discovered I scream the same whether I'm about to be devoured by a Great White or if a piece of seaweed touches my foot." Axl Rose
caberet wrote:
I missed that lol
Maybe the wolves get a clue to the identity of a regular human to help with their menu choices
Dovie'andi se tovya sagain
Jayo wrote:
I'd say give the wolves a TB for some balance
LOL. Check the beginning of the 1st post: Seer succession is proposed to offset the advantage of a wolf TB.I missed that lol
Maybe the wolves get a clue to the identity of a regular human to help with their menu choices
Dovie'andi se tovya sagain
Jayo wrote:
---This message was edited on 2017-04-29 17:24:39---
Maybe the wolves get a clue to the identity of a regular human to help with their menu choices
Do you think that might help?
---This message was edited on 2017-04-29 17:24:39---
Imo I don't think a wolf tb is even powerfull enough to neccessitate the improved seer (have u ever seen a wolf tb very little actually happens of significance) I have no issues with the rules or jayos suggestion, but I wouldn't feel the need to overdo balance
Can you imagine what I would do if I could do all I can - Sun Tzu
Can you imagine what I would do if I could do all I can - Sun Tzu
Wolf TBs used to be more powerful since active and involved players were the norm. Back then, you could orchestrate scuffles between two wolves and have your own "controlled opposition" as the conspiracy theorists put it. It was glorious. These days, they are pretty much useless since people play a lot more casually.
Allowing wolves to clear someone of being the seer at the beginning and every time there is a succession may be a fair way to counterbalance it. E.g. if the seer is killed, you use a randomizer to select a non-seer human and tell the wolves that name.
Index for WW/WTB databases - https://ksteven.github.io/playground/ (Data refreshed: 2021-12-07)
Allowing wolves to clear someone of being the seer at the beginning and every time there is a succession may be a fair way to counterbalance it. E.g. if the seer is killed, you use a randomizer to select a non-seer human and tell the wolves that name.
Index for WW/WTB databases - https://ksteven.github.io/playground/ (Data refreshed: 2021-12-07)
Perhaps. I think seer succession is enough of a novelty for this game. Depending on how it works, any number of tweaks have been put forward that can be tried in future games.
Of course, the entire concept may crash and burn anyway.
---This message was edited on 2017-04-30 18:27:11---
Of course, the entire concept may crash and burn anyway.
---This message was edited on 2017-04-30 18:27:11---
Hello! Seer joining the seer game xP (its not a spoiler, snowy already posted)
fear my cuteness.
fear my cuteness.
talanpoe wrote:
I don't think the wolves need additional help beyond their TB. Especially since one of them may well be a designated seer.
"I discovered I scream the same whether I'm about to be devoured by a Great White or if a piece of seaweed touches my foot." Axl Rose
Jayo wrote:
The wolves have the advantage simply based upon the game rules. This holds despite identities being announced in a timely fashion by most mods. Maybe the wolves get a clue to the identity of a regular human to help with their menu choices
Do you think that might help? I don't think the wolves need additional help beyond their TB. Especially since one of them may well be a designated seer.
"I discovered I scream the same whether I'm about to be devoured by a Great White or if a piece of seaweed touches my foot." Axl Rose
caberet wrote:
But no, other than the wolf talkbox I'm not proposing any advantages for the wolves in this game.
---This message was edited on 2017-05-01 21:05:08---
talanpoe wrote:
I don't think the wolves need additional help beyond their TB. Especially since one of them may well be a designated seer.
Actually, I misunderstood the suggestion. I didn't see much value in telling the wolves the identity of somebody who wasn't a wolf. (I was being sarcastic.) Sorry. Jayo wrote:
The wolves have the advantage simply based upon the game rules. This holds despite identities being announced in a timely fashion by most mods. Maybe the wolves get a clue to the identity of a regular human to help with their menu choices
Do you think that might help? I don't think the wolves need additional help beyond their TB. Especially since one of them may well be a designated seer.
But no, other than the wolf talkbox I'm not proposing any advantages for the wolves in this game.
---This message was edited on 2017-05-01 21:05:08---
nvm this was a dumb idea
---This message was edited on 2017-05-02 09:42:26---
Can you imagine what I would do if I could do all I can - Sun Tzu
---This message was edited on 2017-05-02 09:42:26---
Can you imagine what I would do if I could do all I can - Sun Tzu
Post from The_Spider deleted on 2017-05-02 09:42:31.
Pretty much all TB related ideas are useless these days i say just allow the wolves to PM eachother if they must communicate and call it a day
Index for WW/WTB databases - https://ksteven.github.io/playground/ (Data refreshed: 2021-12-07)
Index for WW/WTB databases - https://ksteven.github.io/playground/ (Data refreshed: 2021-12-07)
I like spider's idea. that might be fun and the wolf TB can be more controlled because they can't openly talk abt their plans.
although add some rules on what 1 post constitutes and it might work.
although add some rules on what 1 post constitutes and it might work.
Ping!
---This message was edited on 2017-05-03 16:55:55---
---This message was edited on 2017-05-03 16:55:55---
ping?
man, it's hard waiting... I'm in game withdrawal.
It's a disease, not a punch line
man, it's hard waiting... I'm in game withdrawal.
It's a disease, not a punch line
Yeah, just 4 more players and we can start.
Oh gosh, I'm too excited!!
Oh gosh, I'm too excited!!
If I may express some annoyance, human promising is becoming a very aggravating trend
Can you imagine what I would do if I could do all I can - Sun Tzu
Can you imagine what I would do if I could do all I can - Sun Tzu
Good morning all, and Happy Cinco de Mayo!!
💃ðŸ¼
Hey
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Hey
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Spider, I promise if I'm human I will not promise I am human.
It's a disease, not a punch line
It's a disease, not a punch line
I preemptively promise that I'm human so yall can sit back and relax now
Index for WW/WTB databases - https://ksteven.github.io/playground/ (Data refreshed: 2021-12-07)
Index for WW/WTB databases - https://ksteven.github.io/playground/ (Data refreshed: 2021-12-07)
How about if we swear we're human instead?
Your love gave me memories too beautiful to forget.
Your love gave me memories too beautiful to forget.
oh, we just need one more person now, don't we?
Yes, just one more to go. Has anyone heard from Sky? He's been gone a whole week now. Hope he's okay.
Your love gave me memories too beautiful to forget.
Your love gave me memories too beautiful to forget.
Up to 14, yes....
And I promise I'm human. (And will continue to be so throughout the game.)
---This message was edited on 2017-05-06 08:54:16---
And I promise I'm human. (And will continue to be so throughout the game.)
---This message was edited on 2017-05-06 08:54:16---
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